the disgrace that is PFI
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the disgrace that is PFI
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Nearly 20 years ago I was vigorously outspoken about the use of PFI to build new hospitals in the UK. I told anyone that would listen that this would cost the NHS a fortune and they would st
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Forums » Off duty » News & media » the disgrace that is PFI
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the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 26/6/2012 6:01 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 1271
First: 13/4/2010 Last: 23/5/2013 |
Nearly 20 years ago I was vigorously outspoken about the use of PFI to build new hospitals in the UK. I told anyone that would listen that this would cost the NHS a fortune and they would still be left, at the end of the initial deals, with hospitals they didn't actually own. To my mind, what was going on was close to criminal extortion. Finally, in 2011, our political masters finally woke up to the facts and a committee of MPs said the "long-term expense of PFI deals - where the private sector shoulders the upfront cost and is typically repaid by the tax payer over a 30-year period - were now much higher than more conventional forms of borrowing". They went on to say "We believe that a financial model that routinely finds in favour of the PFI route, after the significant increases in finance costs in the wake of the financial crisis is unlikely to be fundamentally sound. We do not believe that PFI can be relied upon to provide good value for money without substantial reform." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-14574059 A subsequent report by the House of Commons Public Accounts Committee in May this year said that "in many cases investors had made "eye-wateringly high" profits, with taxpayers trapped in expensive and inflexible contracts for which they are ultimately liable". |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 26/6/2012 6:24 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 59
First: 9/3/2009 Last: 9/11/2012 |
I met Allyson Pollock in a meeting about that time. She was the only voice in opposition to PFI, and has stuck to her guns ever since - but no-one listened for years. I put a motion to my BMA division in 1996 against PFI biut was told "no-one understood it" so it did not go forward. There was a public conspiracy of business interests which carried it through, and they will undoubtedly do the same with other private plans with the new Health bill |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 28/6/2012 11:35 AM BST
on bmj.com
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*Moderator*
Posts: 1452
First: 7/4/2011 Last: 25/5/2013 |
Here's a paper from Allyson Pollock. Page 13 and accompanying text lays out the facts after a FoI request. "As Figure 1 shows, the upfront capital expenditure relating to PFI schemes signed as of 30 November 2006 was £8.3 billion, whereas NHS spending commitments amount to more than £52 billion. Payments to be made by the NHS will therefore be around six times greater than the upfront capital cost to the private sector." http://allysonpollock.co.uk/research/CIPHP_2007_Hellowell_PrivateFinancePublicDeficits.pdf |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 28/6/2012 2:30 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 225
First: 15/5/2012 Last: 22/5/2013 |
In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI: And if that's not a disgrace, on par with the bankers, I don't know what is. Posted by skyesteve I do not know much about this, could anyone be kind to briefly expain. |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 28/6/2012 3:59 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 1271
First: 13/4/2010 Last: 23/5/2013 |
In a nutshell private finance lent money to the Government in the form of building new hospitals which were then loaned to the NHS for an annual rent for the next 30 years or whatever. But it was clear from the start that the rates of interest were exorbitant and, in the early schemes at least, the NHS would still not own the premises once the loans had been repaid. |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 28/6/2012 4:07 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 225
First: 15/5/2012 Last: 22/5/2013 |
In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI: In a nutshell private finance lent money to the Government in the form of building new hospitals which were then loaned to the NHS for an annual rent for the next 30 years or whatever. But it was clear from the start that the rates of interest were exorbitant and, in the early schemes at least, the NHS would still not own the premises once the loans had been repaid. Posted by skyesteve Thank you. All I can say is, what was the Government thinking?. Why can't you get a loan from a bank at reasonable terms?. This is like the credit card scams here in the US, where they give you credit at exorbitant rates and there is no hope for people to dig themselves out of it. |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 29/6/2012 11:06 AM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 1271
First: 13/4/2010 Last: 23/5/2013 |
In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI: In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI : Thank you. All I can say is, what was the Government thinking?. Why can't you get a loan from a bank at reasonable terms?. This is like the credit card scams here in the US, where they give you credit at exorbitant rates and there is no hope for people to dig themselves out of it. Posted by Happy Exactly the points I made at the time |
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 2/7/2012 9:38 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 33
First: 11/2/2011 Last: 2/5/2013 |
In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI: In Response to Re: the disgrace that is PFI : Exactly the points I made at the time Posted by skyesteve With Credit Card companies and Pay Day loan companies the assumption is some members of public don't have the understanding to use these 'tools'. The government has no such excuse! Any investigation needs to look at politicians who turned a blind eye to the cost to the taxpayer in order to secure their own financial future by accepting advisory positions on the boards of these private corporations; which is a form of corruption!
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Re: the disgrace that is PFI
posted at 2/7/2012 10:50 PM BST
on bmj.com
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Posts: 2060
First: 12/3/2010 Last: 24/5/2013 |
Several banks have agreed to write off and to compensate misled customers who were sold PPI, Payment Protection Insurance, because the product was not properly explained to them, who didn't need it or could not afford it, were not given the opportunity to 'shop around' for cheaper, better alternatives and who were charged an unreasonable fees on the small risk taken by the banks. If it has been found by courts and authorities that the miss-selling of PPI was so unsatisfactory as to compel the banks to reverse and cancel the polices, AND to pay compensation, surely the same would apply to PFI? Perhaps the BMA should get a 'no-win-no-fee' solictor to take up the case? John |
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