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ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!
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ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!
Discuss training, careers, and education
Dear forum members, I am applying to university to study a degree in medicine in 2012 and because I have a BA and MA I am not eligble to apply for a student loan to cover my tuition fees. 
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Forums » BMJ » Careers » ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

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Forums  »  BMJ  »  Careers  »  ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 19/4/2011 11:09 AM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 1
First: 19/4/2011
Last: 19/4/2011

The changes completely price me out of medicine. I did a 1 year bachelors degree outside of the UK and now I am banned from all funding and have to pay 9k fees up front with a family income of 14k.

Medicine is a masters degree but they are using the equal or lesser rule to deny me all funding because they refuse to recognise medicine as a masters degree even though every university and the QAA say it is one..

Good news for medical graduates

posted at 19/4/2011 1:06 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 4
First: 27/8/2010
Last: 19/4/2011
Medical graduates can apply online for jobs and also get latest information about conferences and CE Programmes. Instant support and free registration logon to :
http://www.mednaukri.com

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 19/4/2011 4:25 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 18
First: 18/4/2011
Last: 19/5/2011
What does the BMJ think of this issue?

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 19/4/2011 5:33 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 3
First: 19/4/2011
Last: 23/4/2011

Hello,

I am a 25 year old looking to apply to Medical School for 2012.  I am replying to this topic as the bursary for years 2-4 in graduate entry medicine is currently unknown to apply beyond 2011.  As a mature student, I currently do not qualify for a tuition fee loan to cover the costs of studying Medicine due to completing my BSc in Medical Sciences as well as my MSc in Cancer Pharmacology (although this MSc was self-funded).

In this position, I can just about afford to stump up £9000 to cover the first years costs, if the funding stays in place for years 2-4 in graduate entry medicine.  If, however, this funding was revoked and not replaced in some way, I (as well as the vast majority of graduates) would be priced out of going to medical school. 

This would be a disaster as it would effectively end graduate entry medicine or if it still existed, would simply allow the rich to go into medicine at the expense of the middle and lower classes.  I don't think anyone would argue this being a positive.

It is a daunting prospect of having to find up to £36'000 to cover the cost of medical school for four year, especially since entry in 2011 is only £3250 for the first year with the rest being covered by the department of health.  This is an astronomical increase over one year that should not be overlooked.  A lot of students who chose to apply in 2012 last year over entry in 2011 to better prepare themselves financially are reeling at the speed at which this is being pushed through by the government.

This would have a negative impact on the future or healthcare as you would be blocking thousands of potential doctors over the coming years that have been through previous study or life experiences that I believe is extremely beneficial in any profession.  I am asking for is for some sort of funding support or access to a tuition fee loan for courses such as Medicine.  What makes this even more difficult is the withdraw of Professional Studies Loans (from Natwest etc.) that would allow private funding that could be paid back once we’ve completed our training.  Debt is obviously a concern to all of us, however to pursue our dream of becoming a doctor is a price I am personally willing to pay.  With no funding support and a overall cost of up to £36’000, only a very few select group of wealthy students would be able to pursue their dreams of becoming a doctor.

Regards,

Andrew Dickins

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 10:04 AM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 2
First: 20/4/2011
Last: 21/4/2011
I am in the same situation as everyone above. I am 23 and graduated last year in Modern Languages, on a four year degree which built up a lot of debt in tuition fee loans. I decided a year ago to dedicate the rest of my life to my desire to study medicine, and have been juggling a full time badly paid job, study and 3 voluntary roles ever since. Personally, my issue is not the fact that graduates do not receive tuition fee loans, as I do not consider myself to be in a position to take on another loan (however I am fully prepared to back those fighting for this). My line of argument is that I do not understand how the government can cut the funding for accelerated GEM courses. It does not seem fair that somebody who applied for 2011 will only have to pay £3375 and have years 2,3 and 4 funded, when someone like myself who deicded to wait a year in order to save for living costs is now faced with the possibility of receiving no funding, and subsequently, having their dreams of being a Doctor shattered. I know I am not the only person in this position. The idea of the GEM course was to widen access to medicine, and to provide access for people deciding later in life to dedicate their lives to help others - in my opinion, if the government cuts funding for the GEM course, they may aswell scrap the course. Once again, it will only be the very rich that are able to study medicine. Doctors are meant to represent the community that they serve, and this will certainly not be the case if funding is cut. It is very bad timing for the likes of us who have waited to apply for 2012 entry, and we will be severly punished by these funding cuts.

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 10:22 AM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 3
First: 19/4/2011
Last: 21/4/2011
In Response to Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!:
Does anybody know how many graduates have applied to do a degree in medicine this year?
Posted by Rebs


I've been trying to find some data on the number of applicants. So far the best I can do is some data from 2009. This said there were 856 places on 4 year GEP courses at 16 med schools. Of the med schools that released data of the number of applicants (9 courses) the average applicants to places ratio was 13:1, ranging from 22:1 to 7:1.

If you take a conservative estimate on the remaining seven courses of an average ratio of 10:1, that makes the estimate for the total applications 8975. Assuming that everyone applied to 4 GEP courses (certainly this is not the case) that would give a minimum of 2250 applicants. I know this is very rough numbers with a few assumptions and only includes GEP courses, but its a start.

I'd say thats a very conservative estimate. I think only UCAS will have the real data as each med school won't know which other courses applicants have applied to, but UCAS don't seem to release it.


Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 1:47 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 4
First: 25/11/2009
Last: 20/4/2011
First of all, dear posters, it might be a good idea to make sure that you can write good basic English
Graduate's as the plural of graduate??
As every schoolboy knows, the plural is graduates

Re: ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 2:11 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 18
First: 18/4/2011
Last: 19/5/2011
WinkIn Response to Re: ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!:
First of all, dear posters, it might be a good idea to make sure that you can write good basic English Graduate's as the plural of graduate?? As every schoolboy knows, the plural is graduates
Posted by C Valenta


Oops! Holds out wrists for punishment ;)

Re: ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 4:05 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 1
First: 20/4/2011
Last: 20/4/2011
In Response to ATTENTION! Graduates are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!:

1) Does not being able to get a tuition fee loan affect you?
No. I live in Scotland so I was out of the NHS scheme anyway, which sucks because it kinda scrapped any idea of doing medicine I ever had.

2) What will happen to your plans if the NHS scrap the funding of tuition fees for the 5th year and years 2-4 of the graduate degree?
For me? Nothing. I can't apply anyway - I'd struggle to pay the UKCAT and GAMSAT fees, but GEM is my only chance of studying Medicine and it irritates me that other potential doctors have been put off because of fees.

3) How does this make you feel?
Angry! I thought the government were widening access to medicine? Certainly not from where I'm sitting anyway. I'm either going to have to pay 36k for a 4-year GEP or 15k for a normal 5 year in my home country, providing fees in Scotland don't rise massively (which I predict they will) and I might not even get a FY position at the end?! I cannot afford this after my current degree, which I took with the idea of widening my chances when I graduate. I always wanted to be a doctor but I'm genuinely considering switching to ddentistry due to the fact that I cannot afford to be an MD.

4) What are your recommendations for the government?
Stop with this ridiculous plan to charge us horrific amounts to learn. You want doctors? You learn that we can't all afford it. Sorry, Mr Cameron, but we don't all go to Eton. Anyway, last time I checked my country only voted in one Tory MP, so I certainly hope the Scottish Government are going to look at this from both angles.  

5) WRITE TO OR EMAIL YOUR LOCAL MP TODAY!
I will, but I dont know if it would make any difference being Scottish...

Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!

posted at 20/4/2011 10:10 PM BST on bmj.com
Posts: 1
First: 20/4/2011
Last: 20/4/2011
In Response to Re: ATTENTION! Graduate's are being priced out of studying medicine! Your View/Help Needed!!:
First of all, dear posters, it might be a good idea to make sure that you can write good basic English Graduate's as the plural of graduate?? As every schoolboy knows, the plural is graduates
Posted by C Valenta

There was no need for this comment.

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